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	<title>Comments on: Two-Way Hayes Extension is a Step Closer, Though Obstacles Remain</title>
	<atom:link href="http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/</link>
	<description>Covering San Francisco&#039;s livable streets movement</description>
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		<title>By: Jamison Wieser</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3728</link>
		<dc:creator>Jamison Wieser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 03:50:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3728</guid>
		<description>Like Charles said, if you ban cars from the lane then you&#039;ve got the buffer. Since the lane would never be drivable, and only ever parking or Muni, it could be striped in a way that makes it look unusable. The TA suggested hashing for the bus only lanes on Market Street to discourage people from driving in them since until recently the MTA/Muni used the diamond used everywhere else to mark commuter lanes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Like Charles said, if you ban cars from the lane then you&#8217;ve got the buffer. Since the lane would never be drivable, and only ever parking or Muni, it could be striped in a way that makes it look unusable. The TA suggested hashing for the bus only lanes on Market Street to discourage people from driving in them since until recently the MTA/Muni used the diamond used everywhere else to mark commuter lanes.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob Anderson</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3633</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Anderson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 19:36:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3633</guid>
		<description>More anti-car nonsense from the city. Deliberately creating traffic congestion is a poor way to do traffic planning. The Muni #21 line runs on Hayes here, which will only make it slower. The city should leave Hayes Valley alone, especially after the disastrous Octavia Blvd., which is now carrying 45,000 cars a day through the neighborhood. Coming soon: thousands of more cars and residents with the Market/Octavia Plan and UC&#039;s massive housing development on lower Haight Street. Why is this good planning?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>More anti-car nonsense from the city. Deliberately creating traffic congestion is a poor way to do traffic planning. The Muni #21 line runs on Hayes here, which will only make it slower. The city should leave Hayes Valley alone, especially after the disastrous Octavia Blvd., which is now carrying 45,000 cars a day through the neighborhood. Coming soon: thousands of more cars and residents with the Market/Octavia Plan and UC&#8217;s massive housing development on lower Haight Street. Why is this good planning?</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Radulovich</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3602</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Radulovich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 01:04:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3602</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s good to see two-way Hayes moving forward. The wider sidewalks are a welcome change.

MTA could have a two-way, two lane Hayes *without* the tow-away if they were smarter about managing traffic on the City&#039;s street network. One of the problems with Hayes is that it has a massive, high capacity traffic sewer (9th Street) pouring cars onto it. Managing 9th Street better could create less congestion on Hayes.

As my transportation-planner friend often says, MTA is really bad at deciding where they want congestion. There are always bottlenecks in a system; MTA too often lets the traffic pile up where it does the most damage to transit, bicycles, and pedestrians. Think about how Caltrans manages the Bay Bridge; they meter cars coming on the bridge through the toll plaza to keep it moving at most times. MTA could do the same for our streets by modifying the progression of traffic signals to keep auto congestion away from the places where does the most damage to transit, pedestrians, and cyclists.

It would also be great to see the two-way Hayes go all the way back to Market; this would allow the 21-Hayes to run on Hayes in both directions, rather than make the time-consuming dogleg onto Grove. Making lower Hayes two-way, as well as lower Haight would also allow Hayes and Haight to become better transit streets, while allowing Grove and Page to become great bicycle boulevards.

Smart transportation planning allows us to decide how much congestion we want. Smart streets management lets us decide where we want that congestion, and where we don&#039;t.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s good to see two-way Hayes moving forward. The wider sidewalks are a welcome change.</p>
<p>MTA could have a two-way, two lane Hayes *without* the tow-away if they were smarter about managing traffic on the City&#8217;s street network. One of the problems with Hayes is that it has a massive, high capacity traffic sewer (9th Street) pouring cars onto it. Managing 9th Street better could create less congestion on Hayes.</p>
<p>As my transportation-planner friend often says, MTA is really bad at deciding where they want congestion. There are always bottlenecks in a system; MTA too often lets the traffic pile up where it does the most damage to transit, bicycles, and pedestrians. Think about how Caltrans manages the Bay Bridge; they meter cars coming on the bridge through the toll plaza to keep it moving at most times. MTA could do the same for our streets by modifying the progression of traffic signals to keep auto congestion away from the places where does the most damage to transit, pedestrians, and cyclists.</p>
<p>It would also be great to see the two-way Hayes go all the way back to Market; this would allow the 21-Hayes to run on Hayes in both directions, rather than make the time-consuming dogleg onto Grove. Making lower Hayes two-way, as well as lower Haight would also allow Hayes and Haight to become better transit streets, while allowing Grove and Page to become great bicycle boulevards.</p>
<p>Smart transportation planning allows us to decide how much congestion we want. Smart streets management lets us decide where we want that congestion, and where we don&#8217;t.</p>
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		<title>By: Adam</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3588</link>
		<dc:creator>Adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Feb 2009 19:56:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3588</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m skeptical of the peak-hour tow-away lane. If transit-only lanes on Market and Mission are anything to go by, enforcement will be a huge problem, both to prevent cars driving in the lane and illegal parking/unloading.

Any proposal to restrict traffic on transit streets will run into the same challenges. We need to think about how to shave 2-3 minutes (or more) from Muni travel times while gaining the benefits of 2-way conversions. Queue jump lanes (further back, e.g. at Van Ness) and transit signal priority would be possibilities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m skeptical of the peak-hour tow-away lane. If transit-only lanes on Market and Mission are anything to go by, enforcement will be a huge problem, both to prevent cars driving in the lane and illegal parking/unloading.</p>
<p>Any proposal to restrict traffic on transit streets will run into the same challenges. We need to think about how to shave 2-3 minutes (or more) from Muni travel times while gaining the benefits of 2-way conversions. Queue jump lanes (further back, e.g. at Van Ness) and transit signal priority would be possibilities.</p>
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		<title>By: CBrinkman</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3585</link>
		<dc:creator>CBrinkman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:57:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3585</guid>
		<description>Great news, I hope it can go through without the tow-a-way zone and we can instead find a way to reduce the auto traffic delay of Muni. How about making a right turn required from westbound Hayes at Laguna or Buchanan except for Muni: that will get rid of some through traffic on Hayes and speed up Muni but not affect people parking for the retail district.  Make it a Muni priority street.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great news, I hope it can go through without the tow-a-way zone and we can instead find a way to reduce the auto traffic delay of Muni. How about making a right turn required from westbound Hayes at Laguna or Buchanan except for Muni: that will get rid of some through traffic on Hayes and speed up Muni but not affect people parking for the retail district.  Make it a Muni priority street.</p>
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		<title>By: Charles Siegel</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3584</link>
		<dc:creator>Charles Siegel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:52:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3584</guid>
		<description>&quot;Merchants were worried that without the buffer of parked cars in the parking lane, commuters would race through the neighborhood within inches of pedestrians on sidewalks, making the retail environment much less comfortable.&quot;

So, why not ban cars from that towaway lane and make it an exclusive bus lane?  And instruct the buses to go slowly enough that they wouldn&#039;t make the retail environment too uncomfortable - which would still be much faster than they could go in mixed traffic. 

Remember that this would only apply from 4-7 pm - and presumably only on weekdays. 

Not the perfect solution, but perhaps better than any alternative. 

I agree with David Baker (above) that the best solution would be to forget about LOS and stripe an exclusive bus lane - but I don&#039;t know if that is politically possible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Merchants were worried that without the buffer of parked cars in the parking lane, commuters would race through the neighborhood within inches of pedestrians on sidewalks, making the retail environment much less comfortable.&#8221;</p>
<p>So, why not ban cars from that towaway lane and make it an exclusive bus lane?  And instruct the buses to go slowly enough that they wouldn&#8217;t make the retail environment too uncomfortable &#8211; which would still be much faster than they could go in mixed traffic. </p>
<p>Remember that this would only apply from 4-7 pm &#8211; and presumably only on weekdays. </p>
<p>Not the perfect solution, but perhaps better than any alternative. </p>
<p>I agree with David Baker (above) that the best solution would be to forget about LOS and stripe an exclusive bus lane &#8211; but I don&#8217;t know if that is politically possible.</p>
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		<title>By: L</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3583</link>
		<dc:creator>L</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:51:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3583</guid>
		<description>They do the rush hour tow-away zone bus lane in Vancouver on main shopping streets (i.e. Robson St.) and it&#039;s not bad at all.  (Drivers in Vancouver are very good about not driving in the bus lane though, so it&#039;s not commuters whipping by close to pedestrians, it&#039;s a mostly empty lane with the occassional bus.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They do the rush hour tow-away zone bus lane in Vancouver on main shopping streets (i.e. Robson St.) and it&#8217;s not bad at all.  (Drivers in Vancouver are very good about not driving in the bus lane though, so it&#8217;s not commuters whipping by close to pedestrians, it&#8217;s a mostly empty lane with the occassional bus.)</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Fischer</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3580</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Fischer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Feb 2009 06:09:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3580</guid>
		<description>Just imagine how much worse it would have been if the city had followed through on the full 1948 Transportation Plan and destroyed additional entire blocks to build diagonal connections from westbound Hayes to Fell and eastbound Oak to Fell!

I&#039;m really looking forward to seeing this and similar mistakes of the past finally corrected.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just imagine how much worse it would have been if the city had followed through on the full 1948 Transportation Plan and destroyed additional entire blocks to build diagonal connections from westbound Hayes to Fell and eastbound Oak to Fell!</p>
<p>I&#8217;m really looking forward to seeing this and similar mistakes of the past finally corrected.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Fogel</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3579</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Fogel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Feb 2009 04:27:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3579</guid>
		<description>Yay!  Walking down Hayes from Alamo Square to Van Ness station is a (dangerous) maze these days... good to see people are working to fix it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yay!  Walking down Hayes from Alamo Square to Van Ness station is a (dangerous) maze these days&#8230; good to see people are working to fix it.</p>
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		<title>By: David Baker</title>
		<link>http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/09/two-way-hayes-extension-is-a-step-closer-though-obstacles-remain/comment-page-1/#comment-3573</link>
		<dc:creator>David Baker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Feb 2009 03:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1505#comment-3573</guid>
		<description>Great to see this moving forward after so many years.  It&#039;s a difficult balance with MUNI functionality in these situations, but the first priority must be the pedestrians and the local neighborhood livability and health.  

There is so much that could be done by sacrificing auto capacity to allow MUNI to function better that creates unacceptable LOS levels under our current illogical carbon production maximizing environmental analysis standards, soon to change due to the new state level CEQUA guidelines. Go AB-32!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great to see this moving forward after so many years.  It&#8217;s a difficult balance with MUNI functionality in these situations, but the first priority must be the pedestrians and the local neighborhood livability and health.  </p>
<p>There is so much that could be done by sacrificing auto capacity to allow MUNI to function better that creates unacceptable LOS levels under our current illogical carbon production maximizing environmental analysis standards, soon to change due to the new state level CEQUA guidelines. Go AB-32!</p>
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