Comments on: MTA Begins Its First Automated Count of Bicyclists http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/ Covering San Francisco's livable streets movement Tue, 07 Feb 2012 16:15:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Don Miguel http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-55281 Don Miguel Fri, 13 Nov 2009 03:04:49 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-55281 I'm an everyday cyclist. I go past that area pretty much 7 days/week, but I generally avoid the Fell St lanes as getting doored here would dump you into 40 mph traffic. I take Hayes instead. I'm not looking for encouragement or condemnation on the risk/reward of Fell st lanes ;) But, I think this type of situation presents an additional dilemma with the data collection. I’m an everyday cyclist. I go past that area pretty much 7 days/week, but I generally avoid the Fell St lanes as getting doored here would dump you into 40 mph traffic. I take Hayes instead.

I’m not looking for encouragement or condemnation on the risk/reward of Fell st lanes ;) But, I think this type of situation presents an additional dilemma with the data collection.

]]> By: Regular http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3873 Regular Fri, 27 Feb 2009 18:09:39 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3873 I rode by this yesterday at 5 pm. One small problem. The cars waiting to get in to the gas station at Divisadero and Fell are backed up so far that they are blocking this section of the bike lane. So those of us on bikes are swerving around into the adjacent lane, far from the counter. Given that drivers are constantly lining up to get gas here, particularly during rush hour, I suspect that the counter is missing a lot of bike trips. I rode by this yesterday at 5 pm. One small problem. The cars waiting to get in to the gas station at Divisadero and Fell are backed up so far that they are blocking this section of the bike lane. So those of us on bikes are swerving around into the adjacent lane, far from the counter. Given that drivers are constantly lining up to get gas here, particularly during rush hour, I suspect that the counter is missing a lot of bike trips.

]]> By: murphstahoe http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3868 murphstahoe Fri, 27 Feb 2009 08:31:04 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3868 marcos - there are sure to be funding problems for the bike plan and prioritization will occur. A lot of that could come in the form of delaying the pieces that the neighbors whine about. But it's pretty easy to see which projects have the most oomph. My vote for #1 - and it's not even close. Townsend St. marcos – there are sure to be funding problems for the bike plan and prioritization will occur. A lot of that could come in the form of delaying the pieces that the neighbors whine about. But it’s pretty easy to see which projects have the most oomph.

My vote for #1 – and it’s not even close. Townsend St.

]]> By: jass http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3861 jass Fri, 27 Feb 2009 04:16:11 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3861 This is the same technology that lets traffic lights detect a bicycle waiting for a green yes? This is the same technology that lets traffic lights detect a bicycle waiting for a green yes?

]]> By: marcos http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3854 marcos Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:20:27 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3854 CBrinkman wrote: "how do we count the missing cyclists? The ones who would cycle if they felt safe?" We count them once policies are put into place that make it safer to cycle and they do. One potential problem with the count is that if the numbers come in low, that gives the anti-bike people like Rob Anderson a toehold to challenge the level of funding for bike facilities. That almost puts the civil rights of cyclists up for a referendum based on usage. The question is also one of prioritizing scarce resources. I'd rather see the Bicycle Program tell us how they're going to proceed at implementing the policies in the Bicycle Plan that promote safety and convenience rather than instrumenting a few bike lanes and implementing some of the more spurious segments in the 1997 bike network. -marc CBrinkman wrote: “how do we count the missing cyclists? The ones who would cycle if they felt safe?”

We count them once policies are put into place that make it safer to cycle and they do.

One potential problem with the count is that if the numbers come in low, that gives the anti-bike people like Rob Anderson a toehold to challenge the level of funding for bike facilities. That almost puts the civil rights of cyclists up for a referendum based on usage.

The question is also one of prioritizing scarce resources. I’d rather see the Bicycle Program tell us how they’re going to proceed at implementing the policies in the Bicycle Plan that promote safety and convenience rather than instrumenting a few bike lanes and implementing some of the more spurious segments in the 1997 bike network.

-marc

]]> By: CBrinkman http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3851 CBrinkman Thu, 26 Feb 2009 17:21:46 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3851 It will be interesting to know the numbers, even if the counts aren't perfect the first time, or first few times - three cheers to the Bike Program for starting the process of counting. We already know that Market Street had more cyclists then private autos during the rush hours, it will be great to have numbers for other streets as well. Now - how do we count the missing cyclists? The ones who would cycle if they felt safe? It will be interesting to know the numbers, even if the counts aren’t perfect the first time, or first few times – three cheers to the Bike Program for starting the process of counting. We already know that Market Street had more cyclists then private autos during the rush hours, it will be great to have numbers for other streets as well. Now – how do we count the missing cyclists? The ones who would cycle if they felt safe?

]]> By: marcos http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3847 marcos Thu, 26 Feb 2009 14:54:39 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3847 Most streets do not have bike lanes. Most bike lanes will never have sensors. Most bike trips will take place either off the bike lane network or on bike lanes without sensors. What's the math behind taking a specialized subset of a specialized subset and then making broad generalizations from that? -marc Most streets do not have bike lanes.

Most bike lanes will never have sensors.

Most bike trips will take place either off the bike lane network or on bike lanes without sensors.

What’s the math behind taking a specialized subset of a specialized subset and then making broad generalizations from that?

-marc

]]> By: Bryan Goebel http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3844 Bryan Goebel Thu, 26 Feb 2009 07:19:59 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3844 Thanks for the clarification JF that it does pick up aluminum and alloy rims, which I've corrected in the story. It does not pick up carbon fiber wheels. Thanks for the clarification JF that it does pick up aluminum and alloy rims, which I’ve corrected in the story. It does not pick up carbon fiber wheels.

]]> By: JF Rheault http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3835 JF Rheault Thu, 26 Feb 2009 04:39:39 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3835 @ Jeffrey W. Baker Yes, aluminum is fine for detection. @ Jeffrey W. Baker

Yes, aluminum is fine for detection.

]]> By: Jeffrey W. Baker http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3829 Jeffrey W. Baker Thu, 26 Feb 2009 00:28:10 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3829 If the explanation of the operating principle is correct, this seems like it wouldn't work. Most bike wheels (and many entire bikes) contain little or no ferrous metals. Can't these loops detect -any- conductive metal (e.g. aluminum)? If the explanation of the operating principle is correct, this seems like it wouldn’t work. Most bike wheels (and many entire bikes) contain little or no ferrous metals. Can’t these loops detect -any- conductive metal (e.g. aluminum)?

]]> By: murphstahoe http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3827 murphstahoe Thu, 26 Feb 2009 00:12:36 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3827 And in fact the settings should not be designed to "not" detect cars - they should be designed to *differentiate* between cars and bikes - in order to assess the magnitude of the problem of cars driving in and parking in the bike lanes :) And in fact the settings should not be designed to “not” detect cars – they should be designed to *differentiate* between cars and bikes – in order to assess the magnitude of the problem of cars driving in and parking in the bike lanes :)

]]> By: murphstahoe http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3826 murphstahoe Thu, 26 Feb 2009 00:11:15 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3826 This provides an excellent opportunity for warring sides to cook the books. The cyclists can organize group rides that navigate the loop detectors, the anti-cyclists can just double park on top of the loop detector! This provides an excellent opportunity for warring sides to cook the books. The cyclists can organize group rides that navigate the loop detectors, the anti-cyclists can just double park on top of the loop detector!

]]> By: Xanthe Asher http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3825 Xanthe Asher Thu, 26 Feb 2009 00:01:07 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3825 This counting system is great and will lead to better bicycle lanes as well as become a tool to measure riders usage which is leverage for increased funding opportunities for bicycle related development projects. This counting system is great and will lead to better bicycle lanes as well as become a tool to measure riders usage which is leverage for increased funding opportunities for bicycle related development projects.

]]> By: rzu http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/25/mta-begins-its-first-automated-count-of-bicyclists/comment-page-1/#comment-3824 rzu Wed, 25 Feb 2009 23:36:38 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=1606#comment-3824 I noticed the loop detectors in the bike lane just the other day. It would be great to have this kind of data for bike lanes all around the city. I noticed the loop detectors in the bike lane just the other day. It would be great to have this kind of data for bike lanes all around the city.

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