Comments on: If You Build It, Cars Will Come and Require Traffic Lights http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/ Covering San Francisco's livable streets movement Tue, 07 Feb 2012 16:15:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Washington Traffic Laws http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/comment-page-1/#comment-5148 Washington Traffic Laws Thu, 30 Apr 2009 08:19:04 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=2044#comment-5148 Here's what I'd like to see: convert some of the streets in the Presidio to transit-only. With the buses moving faster, they'll be able to have more runs; and that'll get more people out of their cars and onto transit. Here’s what I’d like to see: convert some of the streets in the Presidio to transit-only. With the buses moving faster, they’ll be able to have more runs; and that’ll get more people out of their cars and onto transit.

]]> By: 1776 founding http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/comment-page-1/#comment-5122 1776 founding Wed, 29 Apr 2009 19:24:58 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=2044#comment-5122 Priorities: This entire transportation issue distracts from the idea that NO modern buildings should even be considered in this historic area until the public has access to a real NPS visitor center in building 102, and a museum or vibrant and well staffed historical heritage program (not just a new space for the archaeologists in the officer's club) dedicated to interpreting the history of the Presidio. Fisher's museum is not a gift. If he were a philanthropist, he would build much needed visitor services first. All of this main post planning is trying to slip in before people have any idea of how to value what is there. Given it's founding in 1776, the Main Post should be the west coast complement to Colonial Williamsburg, where people could actually experience history and be transformed. There is no need to "enhance" the visitor experience with this project. The main post IS the attraction, visitors just haven't had a chance to experience it yet. The public has a right to learn the true value of what will be lost forever if the Fisher museum folly is pursued. Priorities:
This entire transportation issue distracts from the idea that NO modern buildings should even be considered in this historic area until the public has access to a real NPS visitor center in building 102, and a museum or vibrant and well staffed historical heritage program (not just a new space for the archaeologists in the officer’s club) dedicated to interpreting the history of the Presidio. Fisher’s museum is not a gift. If he were a philanthropist, he would build much needed visitor services first. All of this main post planning is trying to slip in before people have any idea of how to value what is there. Given it’s founding in 1776, the Main Post should be the west coast complement to Colonial Williamsburg, where people could actually experience history and be transformed. There is no need to “enhance” the visitor experience with this project. The main post IS the attraction, visitors just haven’t had a chance to experience it yet.

The public has a right to learn the true value of what will be lost forever if the Fisher museum folly is pursued.

]]> By: artlover1 http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/comment-page-1/#comment-5098 artlover1 Wed, 29 Apr 2009 06:03:22 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=2044#comment-5098 Excellent reporting. Does'nt Fisher realize that he is on the brink of curdling his standing and reputation in the community if he continues to push his way onto the Main Post, with Crissy Field and the downtown options present? And what a shame that to get onto the Main Post, he will have to reduce the size and dumb down the design of his museum even further, when he could (and should) have a contemporary art museum that looks like one, indeed one that enlivens the SF landscape with a landmark building. And why is the Presidio Trust continuing with this misbegotten plan? Some of its members need to be replaced. Excellent reporting. Does’nt Fisher realize that he is on the brink of curdling his standing and reputation in the community if he continues to push his way onto the Main Post, with Crissy Field and the downtown options present? And what a shame that to get onto the Main Post, he will have to reduce the size and dumb down the design of his museum even further, when he could (and should) have a contemporary art museum that looks like one, indeed one that enlivens the SF landscape with a landmark building. And why is the Presidio Trust continuing with this misbegotten plan? Some of its members need to be replaced.

]]> By: richard emerson http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/comment-page-1/#comment-5097 richard emerson Wed, 29 Apr 2009 05:52:31 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=2044#comment-5097 Very good article, but I was misquoted. There are not 5 times as many visitors to CAS as expected; my point was that the Presidio Trust was calculating visitor traffic to the new museums based on square footage compared to other museums, and that is a bad measure and understates the amount of traffic to be generated. People don't go based on square footage, they go to see the quality of the museum. My point about the CAS visitors was that the new museum sits on basically the same footprint as the old museum, but has substantially (up to 5x) the number of visitors despite square footage because the quality of the museum is better and more compelling. If the Fisher collection is as is stated to be, you will see higher traffic levels than mere square footage would suggest. Part of the equation is fixed - those that want to see it and see the new structure - and part is variable based on the size of the collection. Very good article, but I was misquoted. There are not 5 times as many visitors to CAS as expected; my point was that the Presidio Trust was calculating visitor traffic to the new museums based on square footage compared to other museums, and that is a bad measure and understates the amount of traffic to be generated. People don’t go based on square footage, they go to see the quality of the museum. My point about the CAS visitors was that the new museum sits on basically the same footprint as the old museum, but has substantially (up to 5x) the number of visitors despite square footage because the quality of the museum is better and more compelling. If the Fisher collection is as is stated to be, you will see higher traffic levels than mere square footage would suggest. Part of the equation is fixed – those that want to see it and see the new structure – and part is variable based on the size of the collection.

]]> By: Susan Vaughan http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/comment-page-1/#comment-5092 Susan Vaughan Wed, 29 Apr 2009 04:38:38 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=2044#comment-5092 Actually, paid parking is part of the plan -- but right now only about half of the 2,000 plus Main Post parking spots are occupied on any given weekday. The traffic engineers were required by law to assess traffic impacts once the projects are finished -- and their assessments (the EIS, the SEIS, the SSEIS, and so on, depending on which iteration of the plans are being discussed), which hope for at capacity parking lots, project increased traffic to the extent that mitigation in the form of traffic lights may be needed at six intersections in or near the Main Post, at three intersections on Presidio in Pacific Heights leading up to the Presidio Gate, and at one intersection at Arguello and Washington, leading up to the Arguello Gate. So, paid parking or no, the traffic has been projected to be fairly intense. Actually, paid parking is part of the plan — but right now only about half of the 2,000 plus Main Post parking spots are occupied on any given weekday. The traffic engineers were required by law to assess traffic impacts once the projects are finished — and their assessments (the EIS, the SEIS, the SSEIS, and so on, depending on which iteration of the plans are being discussed), which hope for at capacity parking lots, project increased traffic to the extent that mitigation in the form of traffic lights may be needed at six intersections in or near the Main Post, at three intersections on Presidio in Pacific Heights leading up to the Presidio Gate, and at one intersection at Arguello and Washington, leading up to the Arguello Gate.

So, paid parking or no, the traffic has been projected to be fairly intense.

]]> By: Seth Andrzejewski http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/comment-page-1/#comment-5091 Seth Andrzejewski Wed, 29 Apr 2009 04:12:02 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=2044#comment-5091 If you price parking in the Presidio, you eliminate lots of traffic. I'm surprised that intersections couldn't be mitigated with roundabouts. If you price parking in the Presidio, you eliminate lots of traffic.

I’m surprised that intersections couldn’t be mitigated with roundabouts.

]]> By: jim http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/comment-page-1/#comment-5082 jim Tue, 28 Apr 2009 23:38:25 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=2044#comment-5082 How about putting Fisher's museum at Piers 27-31? 19 acres of space along the water a short walk from the new Exploratorium at Pier 17 would be a great spot for the Fisher art collection. How about putting Fisher’s museum at Piers 27-31? 19 acres of space along the water a short walk from the new Exploratorium at Pier 17 would be a great spot for the Fisher art collection.

]]> By: mattymatt http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/comment-page-1/#comment-5081 mattymatt Tue, 28 Apr 2009 23:15:55 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=2044#comment-5081 It is such bullshit that everyone is resigned to the idea that Muni will always under-serve the Presidio. Simply ridiculous. I take the 43 into the Presidio every day, but most of my coworkers drive. Considering how unreliable their transit options are, I don't blame them. Here's what I'd like to see: convert some of the streets in the Presidio to transit-only. With the buses moving faster, they'll be able to have more runs; and that'll get more people out of their cars and onto transit. It is such bullshit that everyone is resigned to the idea that Muni will always under-serve the Presidio. Simply ridiculous. I take the 43 into the Presidio every day, but most of my coworkers drive. Considering how unreliable their transit options are, I don’t blame them.

Here’s what I’d like to see: convert some of the streets in the Presidio to transit-only. With the buses moving faster, they’ll be able to have more runs; and that’ll get more people out of their cars and onto transit.

]]> By: Josh http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/04/28/if-you-build-it-cars-will-come-and-require-traffic-lights/comment-page-1/#comment-5080 Josh Tue, 28 Apr 2009 23:12:40 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=2044#comment-5080 China basin is so much more appropriate a location for Fisher's monument to himself that I hesitate to even comment further. But if he really wants to plop his museum in the Presidio, he should pay the full cost of extending the F line along the Marina Green to its front door. China basin is so much more appropriate a location for Fisher’s monument to himself that I hesitate to even comment further.

But if he really wants to plop his museum in the Presidio, he should pay the full cost of extending the F line along the Marina Green to its front door.

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