Comments on: The Ghost Streets of San Francisco http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/ Covering San Francisco's livable streets movement Tue, 07 Feb 2012 16:15:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Heather http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-542409 Heather Wed, 11 May 2011 06:46:00 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-542409 These "ghost streets" or "unaccepted streets" as the Department of Public Works calls them, are absolutely fascinating. The neighbors who have decided to engage with these spaces have been really imaginative. This kind of investigation of unusual spaces is exactly what Dubord and the Situationists wanted. They wanted people to seek out alternative possibilities to what exists “through practices such as the derive and pschyogeography ” (Pinder, Visions of the City).The maps that de Monchaux have created are “attempts to ‘undo’ elements of the current socio-spatial order and defend, articulate and promote other values” (Pinder, Visions of the City). In this case, the neighbors took it upon themselves to replenish and maintain their surrounding urban spaces with greenery. De Monchaux’s psychogeographical maps can be used in various hypotheses or attempts to outline new social spaces. The grids of San Francisco were very rigidly planned and implemented, but there are many slivers and nooks of spaces that don’t fit. There are a lot possibilities and opportunities for how these areas can be used, but it requires people to get off of their spectator’s seat and do some wandering. A more mobile engagement with the city allows for people to gain a better understanding how theses space were used in the past and also to imagine multiple future possibilities. It is very much a bottom-up, experimental, social, and local approach to urbanism. These “ghost streets” or “unaccepted streets” as the Department of Public Works calls them, are absolutely fascinating. The neighbors who have decided to engage with these spaces have been really imaginative. This kind of investigation of unusual spaces is exactly what Dubord and the Situationists wanted. They wanted people to seek out alternative possibilities to what exists “through practices such as the derive and pschyogeography ” (Pinder, Visions of the City).The maps that de Monchaux have created are “attempts to ‘undo’ elements of the current socio-spatial order and defend, articulate and promote other values” (Pinder, Visions of the City). In this case, the neighbors took it upon themselves to replenish and maintain their surrounding urban spaces with greenery. De Monchaux’s psychogeographical maps can be used in various hypotheses or attempts to outline new social spaces. The grids of San Francisco were very rigidly planned and implemented, but there are many slivers and nooks of spaces that don’t fit. There are a lot possibilities and opportunities for how these areas can be used, but it requires people to get off of their spectator’s seat and do some wandering. A more mobile engagement with the city allows for people to gain a better understanding how theses space were used in the past and also to imagine multiple future possibilities. It is very much a bottom-up, experimental, social, and local approach to urbanism.

]]> By: Dexter Wong http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-488922 Dexter Wong Sun, 31 Oct 2010 08:03:51 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-488922 One of my favorites is the area near Larkin and Francisco Streets on Russian Hill. At Chestnut Larkin splits to become a brick-lined cul de sac on one side and a narrow curved street that leads to Francisco. At the end of the curve there is a fork that leads to another cul de sac that is the driveway to a secluded house, then becomes a pedestrian path that borders a reservoir and leads to Hyde Street. There is also the Larkin Street steps that go from the first cul de sac to the curved street, a second set of steps that lead to the house and a third set of steps that end in a park and connect to a path that leads toward Larkin and Bay Streets. One of my favorites is the area near Larkin and Francisco Streets on Russian Hill. At Chestnut Larkin splits to become a brick-lined cul de sac on one side and a narrow curved street that leads to Francisco. At the end of the curve there is a fork that leads to another cul de sac that is the driveway to a secluded house, then becomes a pedestrian path that borders a reservoir and leads to Hyde Street. There is also the Larkin Street steps that go from the first cul de sac to the curved street, a second set of steps that lead to the house and a third set of steps that end in a park and connect to a path that leads toward Larkin and Bay Streets.

]]> By: Sharon Johnson http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-483512 Sharon Johnson Mon, 11 Oct 2010 17:03:37 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-483512 Good Morning, Does anyone happen to know the name of the Alley Way between Casselli Avenue and 19th Street between Douglas and Yukon Streets in San Francisco's Eureka Valley Neighborhood. Thank you. Floragrace Good Morning,

Does anyone happen to know the name of the Alley Way between Casselli Avenue and 19th Street between Douglas and Yukon Streets in San Francisco’s Eureka Valley Neighborhood. Thank you.
Floragrace

]]> By: mikesonn http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-480835 mikesonn Mon, 27 Sep 2010 21:43:33 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-480835 I always was amazed by that Reno. It looks like an entrance to the back of the building, but it has a street sign like Andy mentions. I love the two stories above it too. Wonder if that was more common before the earthquake and fire. I always was amazed by that Reno. It looks like an entrance to the back of the building, but it has a street sign like Andy mentions. I love the two stories above it too. Wonder if that was more common before the earthquake and fire.

]]> By: Eric Fischer http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-480825 Eric Fischer Mon, 27 Sep 2010 20:57:56 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-480825 The great thing about Reno is that it actually goes right through a building! I can't think of any other San Francisco streets that do that. The great thing about Reno is that it actually goes right through a building! I can’t think of any other San Francisco streets that do that.

]]> By: Andy http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-480823 Andy Mon, 27 Sep 2010 20:54:27 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-480823 One of my favorite ghost streets is tiny Reno Street in North Beach. Though it does have a street sign, it barely qualifies as a "street" or even an alley; it just seems like a little strip to leave the trash cans, or to access a couple apartments. Great post! One of my favorite ghost streets is tiny Reno Street in North Beach. Though it does have a street sign, it barely qualifies as a “street” or even an alley; it just seems like a little strip to leave the trash cans, or to access a couple apartments. Great post!

]]> By: Eric Fischer http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-384941 Eric Fischer Tue, 08 Jun 2010 18:32:01 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-384941 The "Fout Avenue" also appears in the 1920 city directory (http://www.archive.org/stream/sanfranciscocali1920polk#page/1648/mode/2up) The index describes it as "Fout Avenue, off Eighteenth, from S of Clarendon Ave, S to Pemberton Pl." I think it is now Twin Peaks Boulevard but can't find a map to confirm that right now. The “Fout Avenue” also appears in the 1920 city directory (http://www.archive.org/stream/sanfranciscocali1920polk#page/1648/mode/2up)

The index describes it as “Fout Avenue, off Eighteenth, from S of Clarendon Ave, S to Pemberton Pl.” I think it is now Twin Peaks Boulevard but can’t find a map to confirm that right now.

]]> By: Mary Ellen http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-384701 Mary Ellen Tue, 08 Jun 2010 15:48:29 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-384701 Found your blog while looking for a San Francisco "lost" street. The name is Fout Avenue and was somewhere near Al's Park. Came across the name in 1920 US census record and voter registration. Mrs. Catherine Workman 20 Fout Ave. It is near 328 Corbett Ave. Have you ever heard of it? Found your blog while looking for a San Francisco “lost” street. The name is Fout Avenue and was somewhere near Al’s Park. Came across the name in 1920 US census record and voter registration. Mrs. Catherine Workman 20 Fout Ave. It is near 328 Corbett Ave. Have you ever heard of it?

]]> By: Gerry http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-233191 Gerry Sun, 04 Apr 2010 20:30:09 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-233191 Chris I really enjoyed your blog and photo,along with the comments from your readers. I grew up in S.F. and many of the areas I have traveled. Does anyone know where I can find photo of the Crocker Amazon Naval Housing Projects that were up in the 1950's? I recall that area and remember the housing behind the now beautified Crocker Amazon Park. Chris I really enjoyed your blog and photo,along with the comments from your readers. I grew up in S.F. and many of the areas I have traveled. Does anyone know where I can find photo of the Crocker Amazon Naval Housing Projects that were up in the 1950′s? I recall that area and remember the housing behind the now beautified Crocker Amazon Park.

]]> By: jefferson http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-66721 jefferson Sat, 05 Dec 2009 22:15:47 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-66721 hey Chris, glad I stumbled on this. alot of fun. maybe I'll run into you at a Giants game again next year. jefferson hey Chris,
glad I stumbled on this. alot of fun.
maybe I’ll run into you at a Giants game again next year.

jefferson

]]> By: Dinah Sanders http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-47541 Dinah Sanders Thu, 22 Oct 2009 01:52:37 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-47541 What a fantastic post! Thanks so much for sharing these. I'm chipping away at a many year project of walking every street, every block in San Francisco and these are some great treasures to seek out as I fill things in. Perhaps a bunch of us SF street geeks should get together sometime for a ramble? What a fantastic post! Thanks so much for sharing these. I’m chipping away at a many year project of walking every street, every block in San Francisco and these are some great treasures to seek out as I fill things in.

Perhaps a bunch of us SF street geeks should get together sometime for a ramble?

]]> By: Danny http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-28831 Danny Wed, 26 Aug 2009 03:33:59 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-28831 I second throgers! Those keymaps are an amazing cache for the detail-oriented. Other useful maps can be found at http://bsm.sfdpw.org/subdivision/dpwweb/. I second throgers! Those keymaps are an amazing cache for the detail-oriented. Other useful maps can be found at http://bsm.sfdpw.org/subdivision/dpwweb/.

]]> By: Glenn Bachmann http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-28791 Glenn Bachmann Tue, 25 Aug 2009 23:20:05 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-28791 A very enjoyable article, Chris! I actually saw a link to it on the Flickr group <a href="http://www.flickr.com/groups/guesswheresf/" rel="nofollow">Guess Where SF</a>, which I've mentioned to you before, and I suggest you join (I think you would be really good at it). The previous two commenters I recognize from that group as well. A very enjoyable article, Chris! I actually saw a link to it on the Flickr group Guess Where SF, which I’ve mentioned to you before, and I suggest you join (I think you would be really good at it). The previous two commenters I recognize from that group as well.

]]> By: throgers http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-28751 throgers Tue, 25 Aug 2009 21:52:22 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-28751 Neat post! If you want to take the dorking out to a new level, the DPW key maps (http://bsm.sfdpw.org/subdivision/keymap/) can be used to figure out if an area is technically part of the public right-of-way. Neat post! If you want to take the dorking out to a new level, the DPW key maps (http://bsm.sfdpw.org/subdivision/keymap/) can be used to figure out if an area is technically part of the public right-of-way.

]]> By: Eric Fischer http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-28681 Eric Fischer Tue, 25 Aug 2009 19:06:38 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-28681 Legally, even some waterways in San Francisco are officially streets! (Channel Street for Mission Creek, Islais Street for Islais Creek) Legally, even some waterways in San Francisco are officially streets! (Channel Street for Mission Creek, Islais Street for Islais Creek)

]]> By: Omri http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-28671 Omri Tue, 25 Aug 2009 18:59:34 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-28671 "If there is no flat surface underfoot, i.e. it's all stairs, isn't it something other than a street?" No. A street is a public right of way. Plenty of streets around the world are too narrow for cars, or composed of steps (e.g. the Spanish Steps in Rome, or some spots on the northern tip of Manhattan). In the Arab World, some streets have roofs (the casbahs). “If there is no flat surface underfoot, i.e. it’s all stairs, isn’t it something other than a street?”

No. A street is a public right of way. Plenty of streets around the world are too narrow for cars, or composed of steps (e.g. the Spanish Steps in Rome, or some spots on the northern tip of Manhattan). In the Arab World, some streets have roofs (the casbahs).

]]> By: Cereal http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-28631 Cereal Tue, 25 Aug 2009 18:03:09 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-28631 "If I may quibble over semantics, please: the quote marks are unnecessary. Even if it's not passable by a car, it's still a street." I'm not so sure about this statement. Car access is certainly not a requirement of street-ness, I agree. But -if it's not paved, is it still a "street?" Or perhaps a path? If it's incredibly narrow, wouldn't it be more like an alley or a passage (at best) than a street? The narrow space between a pair of buildings, if navigable, surely isn't a "street?" If there is no flat surface underfoot, i.e. it's all stairs, isn't it something other than a street? “If I may quibble over semantics, please: the quote marks are unnecessary. Even if it’s not passable by a car, it’s still a street.”

I’m not so sure about this statement.

Car access is certainly not a requirement of street-ness, I agree.

But -if it’s not paved, is it still a “street?” Or perhaps a path?

If it’s incredibly narrow, wouldn’t it be more like an alley or a passage (at best) than a street? The narrow space between a pair of buildings, if navigable, surely isn’t a “street?”

If there is no flat surface underfoot, i.e. it’s all stairs, isn’t it something other than a street?

]]> By: Omri http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-28581 Omri Tue, 25 Aug 2009 03:56:05 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-28581 If I may quibble over semantics, please: the quote marks are unnecessary. Even if it's not passable by a car, it's still a street. If I may quibble over semantics, please: the quote marks are unnecessary. Even if it’s not passable by a car, it’s still a street.

]]> By: James http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-28561 James Tue, 25 Aug 2009 02:16:47 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-28561 I live next door to the person who owns the sculpture in the first shot and this isn't doing her justice. She has some amazing sculptures, about 2 dozen total, all over her yard. They are all different, and blend together beautifully. I live next door to the person who owns the sculpture in the first shot and this isn’t doing her justice. She has some amazing sculptures, about 2 dozen total, all over her yard. They are all different, and blend together beautifully.

]]> By: Peter http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/08/24/eyes-on-the-street-the-ghost-streets-of-san-francisco/comment-page-1/#comment-28551 Peter Tue, 25 Aug 2009 01:32:23 +0000 http://sf.streetsblog.org/?p=30341#comment-28551 I think many of you may know the book "Stairway Walks of San Francisco" by Adah Bakalinsky, but if you don't, you should definitely get a copy. It covers a number of the streets mentioned here, as well as a bunch of other stairways and "ghost" streets. My wife and I find that taking any of these walks is a true joy and have done most of them by this point. Most walks are an hour or so at a leisurely pace, and I highly recommend it for urban walkers. We find it especially nice to take the Muni to the start of the walk, so we can learn some new Muni lines as well. I see it is available on Amazon, including used editions, but I think many local bookstores have it as well. I think many of you may know the book “Stairway Walks of San Francisco” by Adah Bakalinsky, but if you don’t, you should definitely get a copy. It covers a number of the streets mentioned here, as well as a bunch of other stairways and “ghost” streets.

My wife and I find that taking any of these walks is a true joy and have done most of them by this point. Most walks are an hour or so at a leisurely pace, and I highly recommend it for urban walkers. We find it especially nice to take the Muni to the start of the walk, so we can learn some new Muni lines as well.

I see it is available on Amazon, including used editions, but I think many local bookstores have it as well.

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