Streetsblog San Francisco

Where is the Nextbus sign? Also, what good are new shelters when there are less and less buses servicing them?

Can I suggest that you and Judson both try referring to these as “transit shelters” rather than “bus shelters”? After all, you can wait for streetcars at some of them, too.

What good is a solar shelter when the advertisements therein suggest flying in airplanes?

@Todd Let’s not get silly here. First of all the solar panels will work with the same effectiveness regardless of what ads are on the shelter.

Secondly; airline ads are rarely intended to encourage people to fly who would otherwise use transit, they are intended to encourage use of one airline over another airline.

Why are we spending money on new bus shelters, and a central subway for that matter? MUNI is broke, and today MTA recommended deep service cuts and some draconian fare increases. Insane.

Actually, because you will be waiting even longer for your bus, maybe they should be fully enclosed and heated. $90 Fast Passes could cover the cost.

Is Muni planning on keeping any of the old shelters completely intact and stationary, by any chance?

I think Judson True’s statement if correct. The reason that all of the shelters don’t have solar panels is quite logical. Solar photovoltaic production is quite compromised by shadowing from buildings and trees, so if there is significant physical shadowing it would make sense to not install there. Also, since these are “grid tie” systems, having no storage batteries (expensive, bulky, they degrade over time, and contain toxic metals etc) the shelter has to have an electrical grid connection for the solar to make sense. Some shelters don’t.

Even if Clear Channel is paying for the new shelters, why were they needed? Muni almost certainly could have come away from this advertising procurement with a higher net return on the contract by letting the new vendor simply take over the old transit shelters. The ad frames seem to be the same size anyway, and most of the old shelters seemed to be in pretty good shape. While I like the new shelter design, what happens when that pretty neon gets snapped by vandals or just burns out? Does it get replaced by the vendor at all, and if so, does the cost go onto a maintenance ledger that is not capped (thus reducing Muni’s net return from the contract)?

This matters because at the time of this procurement, Muni management knew, or should have known, of the financial tsunami offshore. The signs of it have been clear to any informed observer for several years now. So just saying, “not to worry, the vendor’s paying for it” seems a little simplistic to me.

As David Baker explained above, solar cells work when the sun shines. In order to have electricity when the sun isn’t shining, a system needs to be hooked up to the grid or have battery back-up. Unless you’re in a remote area with no electrical service, it is more economical and requires less maintenance for the grid to act as a de facto battery back-up. Most homes in the city that have solar panels are in the same situation.