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    You’re not getting the point. Under California State law, it’s illegal to start your cross when the countdown timer is active. You can only start to cross when the white hand is activated.


    Dave Moore

    I think most people would agree that pedestrians have a right to cross the street without being buzzed by bikes or cars, even if they aren’t hit. They shouldn’t have to Frogger it. There might even be a code. There is for cyclists, right? 3 feet? Shouldn’t pedestrians get at least that?

    And, ah, no I didn’t.



    The protest is misrepresenting the situation because of the inflated number of cyclists who showed up. It was more like a critical mass thing where the entire purpose was to block traffic

    A cyclist obeying the same rules as other road users does not slow anyone down.



    The “three foot” law got passed precisely because cyclists FEEL unsafe when a vehicles comes close to a cyclist.

    There was already a law against a vehicle hitting a cyclist, so the three feet law was all about how cyclists FEEL.

    So why do you not care how pedestrians FEEL about the exact same thing done by cyclists?



    What is wrong with knowing how long you have to cross? A white hand and then a sudden light change is worse



    Good point. And I agree that if a cyclists farts, unfairly it becomes front page news. That’s why I think PR is just as much part of the success model for this proposal as anything else.



    When it comes to rolling stops for bikes, I’d like to see where Supervisor Scott Wiener and the more progressive members of the BOS stand on this? Would they share similar stands/perspectives as Supervisor London Breed just did?



    I live in two different cities and I love them both. But there’s no doubt that for those walking, biking or driving, people in San Francisco are more distracted and more easily unhinged than people in Barcelona. And you kind of prove my point regarding unhinged.



    Cars “come close” to hitting me every day, but I don’t whine and cry about it. Define “close” for me. Within 10 feet? 5 feet?



    What is the accident rate in Vietnam vs. the United States? Or better yet, vs. The Netherlands, where people actually know how to drive.


    Dave Moore

    You’re telling me that it’s ok for a cyclist to come close to hitting a pedestrian but as long as they don’t make contact then the pedestrian is a “ninny” for feeling unsafe? Maybe you’re trolling but, wow.


    Hata H. Zappah

    And those cyclists are riding down the streets like this: (I’m so sorry to have to show you the truth.)



    There is another way out of this as well. Just rip out all the frivolous stop signs. SF has a crazy over-abundance of stop signs, especially out in the avenues.

    Having said that, I can already hear the whining arguments. Uncontrolled intersections aren’t going to destroy life as we know it. When you have too many stop signs, you end up racing as fast as you can from one to the next. This is far more dangerous than driving regularly, slowing down and carefully going through an intersection.



    Zero Vision.



    Of course, SFBC isn’t doing jack to confront SFPD on this harassment. Too busy with their power grab or just not a priority?



    That is exactly the point. They “feel” unsafe. There is no evidence for their emotional point of view, but they feel that way. The police should not allocate resources on the basis of a few scared ninnies “feelings.”



    Glad to see Lee taking such a positive stance toward cycling, especially in light of the draft EIR for the proposed Warriors stadium that calls for increased cycling infrastructure as one of the primary ways to mitigate the widespread gridlock anticipated on event days.


    Hata H. Zappah

    The “Stop-In” is indeed a waste of intelligence. Because if you think that intentionally crowding intersections with people stopping at each intersection will not prove the folly of the stop signs, but rather the folly of the protestors, who are more akin to people who climb on top of BART trains when they think we all should be protesting police brutality instead of going home and resting up for next day’s work or school.



    If all the cyclists were driving cars instead and slowing your commute you’d be probably be even more annoyed.



    Here’s my perspective of why tickets are being issued:
    I was looking at CVC 21752(d) which prohibits vehicles from driving on
    the left side of the roadway in certain situations. Subsection D states it’s prohibited: “When approaching within 100 feet of or when traversing any intersection.” ( see the third section)

    Here’s an example of why someone can’t pass any vehicle within 100 feet of an intersection: Some Muni bus lines must travel on two lane roads; prior to the stop sign, they discharge passengers at a bus stop, but is unable to fully pull over. If a car driver is behind the bus, they cannot lawfully pass the bus to the left to get away from the bus (remember, Muni buses are 30 to 60 feet long). One major safety reason for that law is if a Muni passenger is to cross the street perpendicular and in front of the bus, it’s one big blind spot for the car driver attempting to illegally pass and could hit the pedestrian. Even for myself who lives on a two lane street with a bus line, if I cross in front of the bus, I slow down and stick my head out first to see if any impatient drivers are attempting to pass.

    If the law states that bicycle riders must follow the same traffic laws as car drivers, bicyclists can operate their bike in the contraflow lane, but has to return back 100 feet prior to reaching the intersection. It does not matter if there’s a painted double yellow line 100 feet prior to an intersection or not.


    Hata H. Zappah

    Shouldn’t the cyclist have stopped period and waited for the police to come? Maybe if we require all bicycles to have license plates, this will take care of that?


    StrixNoctis .

    I actually care about the motor vehicles failing to signal for turns because too often they also fail to merge into a bike lane prior to making a right turn. That combined with their inability to in their many blind spots makes intersections very dangerous for us cyclists.

    That scenario is, I believe, why a lot of cyclists don’t like waiting next to motor vehicles at intersection stops and choose to illegally roll through or wait in the crosswalk (not that motorists don’t do the same). I don’t like it myself, but I deal with it as best as I can (and expect to get killed by a right hook sooner or later).

    I don’t understand today’s tolerance for no turn signaling. It’s extremely dangerous! It’s not always easy to guess if a driver intends to turn and if they can see me. It takes a mind reader to drive safely these days.



    Advocating for the SFPD to stop this dumbass sting on the wiggle and focus on things like drunk driving and cars not yielding rght of way is not advocating for improvements for cyclists. It’s advocating for improvements for everyone. You are smart enough to know that but yet your words disagree. Such a waste of intelligence.


    Dave Moore

    Where did I say that people who cycle don’t care about pedestrians? When I said there are far fewer cyclists I was referring specifically to why there might be fewer complaints about cars blocking their lanes than pedestrians complaining about cyclists running through crosswalks. I don’t think that’s bizarre. I didn’t say which I thought was worse or more dangerous based on these numbers. The cyclists are certainly in more danger than the pedestrians. But you shouldn’t be shocked that their complaints are being responded to.

    It’s true I don’t cycle. I would say that some of my best friends are cyclists if the obvious joke wouldn’t be misconstrued. I do have plenty of friends and coworkers who do cycle and I do give a shit about them.

    I also live here. I work here. I have a house here. I have a kid here. As far as I know you don’t. What I see is you not looking for solutions to problems but instead simply advocating for improvements for cyclists. If that has a negative impact on everyone else, you don’t give a shit.


    Hata H. Zappah

    Not every intersection. Just the busiest. And usually not at inconvenient times. I imagine you knew that, but the itch to snark was too great.


    Hata H. Zappah

    I want to know how the protest went. Because I haven’t heard anything one way or the other, so that leads me to believe that their protest did not go as planned, and no one was bothered by them…wait for it…following the law. . Of course, if we do hear from the Wigg Party, they will most likely color this in the same vein as their strong-arm, er, “open letter” to the SFPD. If ever you needed a visual to go along with the phrase “that went over like a lead balloon”…



    I know. I’m totally guilty on this one. I usually avoid this nonsense but since he’s new around here I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he could make some sense. But it’s hopeless and I give up. Need to save my energy. You know, that whole applying finite resources efficiently thing.



    I’m glad they’re cracking down. Bicyclist do honestly get annoying


    Michael Mathews

    You know there is one light in SF that occasionally turns green for cars and immediately counts down for pedestrians. Maybe there were a few microseconds where it was legal for me to step off the curb, but I didn’t see any white hand time. Do the police think I should then wait a whole cycle until it becomes legal because of some weird malfunction? Check out 18th and Church, crossing Church, when the J train comes and alters the signal timing.



    I would like to ask where the fuck are all the police when I see DOZENS of cars illegally crossing the double yellow line on my street EVERY DAY as they pass illegally double parked vehicles in front of a school.

    Totally outrageous. This is becoming material for a 14th Amendment (Equal Protection Clause) civil rights lawsuit against the city.



    “I fear some lunatic motorist (like those on the videos posted below)
    will get super pissed and floor it through the cyclists or buzz them
    close enough to him them causing injuries.”

    I cannot even count anymore the times that people have committed vehicular assault against me when I was bicycling perfectly legally in San Francisco.

    I am totally disgusted with the rancid way San Francisco is being run with respect to law enforcement and bicycles. Anyone bicycling in San Francisco is subject to death, serious injury, abuse, harassment, and high amounts of theft. And this is how the city shows its appreciation.

    Totally rancid!

    Why can’t we elect good leaders?

    Come on people!



    “all the rest of us are just useless bums who walk around town dragging our feet and yelling “Uuuuung!”

    I could not have said it better myself. Uuuuung is going to be my new twitter handle


    City Resident

    I agree that bicyclists should stop in front of crosswalks (as should motorists) when there’s a red light. At this particular location, a bike box is needed and would help to ensure that bicyclists do not enter the crosswalk when the light is red. Unfortunately in San Francisco, it’s very common place for motorists and cyclists to stop in crosswalks (although it’s a far greater obstruction and a greater safety risk when motorists do so).


    Hata H. Zappah

    You really don’t know how to make a succinct point, do you? This is about not giving in to a small but very vocal minority, even out of you cyclists, who think that their way is the only way. Apparently said vocal minority are the only parties capable of using logic and all the rest of us are just useless bums who walk around town dragging our feet and yelling “Uuuuung!” Said minority has also thought it pertinent to “lay down the law” and tell the officers what they will do, as though said minority were their bosses. No. Just no.


    Hata H. Zappah

    What do you want them to do, have them read a biography of each person involved, so you can then go and sweep up all down Tear River?


    Hata H. Zappah

    No, what they’re confounded by are guerilla style tactics and an unwillingness on the part of Wigglers to cooperate or even listen. I support the Mayor’s decision because once again, a very vocal minority has their say about something and can’t back down to save their soul.



    But you don’t cycle. So you don’t give a shit. But you’ll pop onto some blogs accusing people who do cycle for not giving a shit about pedestrians, which is untrue.

    It all ties into the bogus arguments you make in some attempt to make some bizarre point, simply because you are a pretty smart guy and this is a game to you. For example – “there are far fewer cyclists than pedestrians”. Pedestrians spend the vast majority of their time on the sidewalk, which is nominally protected space – modulo the known [cretins/people deathly afraid of cars] who cycle on sidewalks and the cretins who park their car on sidewalks. Cyclists spend all of their time mixing it up on the roads.


    City Resident

    It’s also in the interest of motorists (and all road users for that matter) to have bicyclists pass through intersections fairly quickly. As noted in today’s Examiner, in the same time it takes a bicycle to pass through an intersection (when starting from a stopped position) two to three cars can pass through. This slows down motorists and increases the exposure of bicyclists to collisions. The design of many automobiles limits a driver’s senses (especially vision/sight lines) and therefore makes the importance of coming (at least close) to a full stop more important. As demonstrated in Idaho, bicyclists can safely treat stop signs as yield signs – and everyone (including pedestrians) stands to benefit.



    The really sad thing about the “bicycle lanes” in the city is that, if you are on any of the majority of other streets in the city which do not have “lanes”, the situation is dire. And in fact it is actually quite abhorrent on many which do have “lanes”. I appreciate that any money is spent on bicycle lanes and safety measures, but the overall fact is that bicycling in the city mostly sucks very badly and is unsafe and extremely stressful. The city should be glad that anyone at all goes out on a bicycle and braves the threats to safety, frequent abuse, and rampant theft.
    If anything, the city should be trying to thank bicyclists and not engaging in petty bitching crap against them. Remember, people are reguarly being killed, harassed, and victimized in other ways.
    Wake up San Francisco.


    City Resident

    Clearly bicyclists, like everyone else, must be cognizant of pedestrians and respect their right-of-way (and nearly all bicyclists do so). I hope that you are aware that when the police opt to crack down on bicyclists for petty violations, they end up making bicycling a more cumbersome and expensive mode of transportation (at least for those who are cited). It’s very much in the interest of pedestrians to have the mode share of bicycles continue to increase in San Francisco. More bicycles on the streets inevitably results in fewer cars and safer streets.


    boter op mijn hoofd

    Bad luck!



    I’m all for equal enforcement, but it’s the same as cars changing lanes without signalling or “california” stops, no one really cares unless you violate someone’s right of way (plus it’s way more dangerous when you use a CAR than a bike). Ticket bikers that blow through stops at full speed. Other bikers agree with that. But frivolous ticketing creates a bad environment. Similarly ticketing pedestrians that start crossing after the countdown begins, but while they can still make it safely across the street.

    As always, it’s the CARS that present the greatest danger and threat for all other users. CARS that take the majority of street space and frequently violate the rights of other users; blocking bike lanes and parking on sidewalks, and everyone’s favorite, creating logjams blocking crosswalks.

    Ticket dangerous behavior, those who violate right of way and endanger others. Time to reform the laws. and well guess what, time to show up in force for critical mass!!! Remember the tensions that flared? What would happen if bikers took over the streets like the protesters of late? Imagine a sea of bicycles on market st, or surrounding city hall. It’d be an amazing sight.



    Okay, but to say “the police’s hands are tied” is still inaccurate. If they get complaints that aren’t backed up by crash data they could just as easily say to those individuals “we hear you but we have bigger fish to fry”. It happens all the time, and legitimately so if the goal is to make sure traffic enforcement is targeted to have the biggest impact on safety. That’s the whole beef with the bike ticketing spree.



    Mabey on your planet, but not in SF. Banning bicycles on most streets in SF is inevitable.
    I can’t wait!


    Ziggy Tomcich

    This fall vote for anybody but Lee! We have ranked voting, plenty of opposition candidates, and a mayor who is pretty much disdained by everyone who lives here who makes less than $250k a year.


    Dave Moore

    Or maybe it’s because the pedestrians can complain right there and then and the cyclists have to wait until they get home and aren’t so angry. Not that I haven’t seen a cyclist or two on their phone while riding.

    /dave ducks from the immediate stream of replies about drivers talking on their phones.


    Dave Moore

    I’m not defending the people who park in the cycle lane. I see it on Oak and Fell all the time and if I cycled I probably would be angry and complain. But there are far fewer cyclists than pedestrians. Maybe it’s a question of numbers.


    Dave Moore

    I didn’t say they were obligated to do selective enforcement. I said once they decided to they had to grab everyone, regardless of whether they were running the stop signs courteously or not. It was their choice to do it, but they made that decision based on complaints.



    Here’s another example.

    - On Valencia, most motorists park.
    – The bulk of these do so in a parking spot.
    – Some (a minority but still signifcant percentage) double park in the bike lane. Not to the point of colliding with cyclists, but forcing them out of the lanes they earned with blood sweat and tears into the primary travel lane that has some (a minority but still significant percentage) impatient motorists who really go apeshit when a cyclist is in the primary travel lane despite the 13 MPH timing.
    – Cyclists complain
    – Police don’t do jack shit.



    I won’t bend to interests who disregard safety. Except my optometrist. And Rose Pak. And myself.